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 Teema pealkiri: Re: GPS-i häkkimine?
PostitusPostitatud: 25 Aug, 2017 8:19 
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MMX kirjutas:
Mõni kuu tagasi lugesin ameeriklaste artiklit sellest, et nende laevastikus on liiga palju hakatud lootma igasugustele gee-pee-essidele ja traditsioonilsed, st head navigeerimis- ja meresõiduoskused ning tavad on hakanud kaduma. Eks see nii olegi. Kui ikka tanker, mille kursimuutuseks on vaja mitu miili, hävitajale pihta saab, siis on viga hävitaja kapteni poolses, nagu õeldakse, heade meresõidutavade rikkumises. Artiklis oli kirjas ka see, et väljaõppes tuleb nüüd taas kindlalt pähe taguda kaart-kompass-logi-kronomeeter-sekstant jne.


Julgen nõustuda. Meite maal toimunud õppustel on neile paberist kaardi ja kilega töötamist õpetatud, mõned polnud enne midagi kuulnud sellest.


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 Teema pealkiri: Re: GPS-i häkkimine?
PostitusPostitatud: 25 Aug, 2017 11:32 
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Tsiteeri:
Mõni kuu tagasi lugesin ameeriklaste artiklit sellest, et nende laevastikus on liiga palju hakatud lootma igasugustele gee-pee-essidele ....

IMHO mitte lihtsalt n.ö. "igasuguste geepeeesside peale", vaid lausa tavaliste tsiviilkäibes olevate GPS-ide peale....

****

The American Military's Greatest Vulnerability: No GPS in a War
Tsiteeri:
If we lost GPS worldwide, most of our warfighters—in fact, all of our warfighters—would lose the ability to navigate and tell time and drop the precision munitions and do everything we do with GPS. If we lose GPS tomorrow, none of our warfighters can fight, but your iPhone can still tell you where you are and get you down the street.

http://nationalinterest.org/blog/the-bu ... -war-18085

When GPS falters, where will the military turn?
Tsiteeri:
“Needless to say, that is a capability that we are going to just have to sustain. The world wouldn’t have it any other way,” Gen William Shelton, chief of the Air Force Space Command, said at a breakfast on Feb. 7 discussing the new GPS III system, as reported by National Defense Magazine. “Do we have too much dependence on GPS? That is the question we are starting to ask across the Department of Defense. The answer is not to get off GPS, however. That will never be the answer in my view.”

The new GPS III system is expected to affordably replace legacy GPS satellites and improve anti-jamming capabilities. The system includes a new military code, or M-code, that uses a different frequency than public signals and is more resistant to jamming.

Tsiteeri:
Loran, short for Long Range Navigation, enabled ships and aircraft to determine location and speed from low-frequency radio signals that are transmitted by radio beacons. Made obsolete by GPS, the system was shut down in 2010. However, a new, digitized-version of the system, called eLoran, has been gaining ground as a possible GPS back-up system.

eLoran signals are nearly unjammable due to their high power; the signals have about 1.3 million times more power than GPS signals. The radio towers are land-based, meaning that they are not susceptible to space debris or space warfare and can operate concurrently with GPS, but can only provide a certain range.

https://defensesystems.com/articles/201 ... tives.aspx



Tsiteeri:
"The Air Force wants a system that will still be up when, or if, the current system is attacked in some way," says Leemon Baird, a senior research scientist at the Academy Center for Cyber Space Research (ACCSR). "If you have multiple systems it is harder to attack them all."

The Obama administration is also moving forward on a plan to shut down the only current backup to GPS, a permanent ground station network called LORAN-C that is run by the Coast Guard. The Department of Homeland Security last year started a painful upgrade to LORAN-C, adding modern electronics and solid-state transmitters, despite the fact that in 2008 President George W. Bush signed a law that scheduled the system's dissolution.

The improved system, called eLORAN, would acquire loctaions by triangulating signals from ground stations and be able to pass detailed information through an improved communication channel. The new hardware would also have a data channel that could handle more detailed information. But LORAN-C—the only functioning backup to GPS—will be dismantled by October 2010, according to an early January Coast Guard announcement in the Federal Register. With LORAN-C dead, the upgraded system is now useless.

http://www.popularmechanics.com/space/s ... 0/4343983/


The Global Positioning System for Military Users: Current Modernization Plans and Alternatives
CONGRESS OF THE UNITED STATES CONGRESSIONAL BUDGET OFFICE. October 2011
Tsiteeri:
Description and Cost of DoD’s Plan
During the next decade, DoD plans to purchase enough
of the next-generation GPS III satellites to eventually
replace the entire constellation and to upgrade the
ground control system so that
it can fully control existing
and future satellites. DoD also plans to develop military
receivers that can decode the new M-code signals and to
purchase and field those receivers to all military users.

DoD’s plans currently include launching the remaining
10 (out of 12 total) IIF satellites—the latest model of
GPS II satellite—and deploying an entirely new genera-
tion of GPS III satellites. As of February 2011, the Air
Force expected to launch the last IIF satellite (which was
purchased in 2006) in 2014. The GPS III satellites,
which are designed to have stronger military signals, are
already under development, although the full rollout of
that program will not be completed until 2030. Accord-
ing to Air Force plans, the GPS III satellite program will
be carried out in three stages, with each stage yielding sat-
ellites of increasing capability......

The Congressional Budget Office examined three
alternatives to the Department of Defense’s plan that
would modernize the Global Positioning System,
improve the system’s performance in a jamming environ-
ment, and address some of the concerns about DoD’s
plan. The alternatives, or options, would reduce the cost
of modernizing and controlling the GPS satellite constel-
lation, as well as the risk of developing it, by canceling the
IIIB and IIIC satellite portions of the program. The
options would also make these changes:

Option 1 would improve current GPS receivers by fit-
ting them with better antennas and by adding tightly
integrated inertial navigation systems (INSs).

Option 2 would capitalize on a DoD research and
development program known as iGPS, or High Integ-
rity GPS, by enabling modified GPS receivers to use
information received via the Iridium commercial com-
munications satellite network to improve performance
in the presence of jammers.

Option 3 would carry out the improvements included
in both Option 1 and Option 2.

https://www.cbo.gov/sites/default/files ... 28-GPS.pdf

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 Teema pealkiri: Re: GPS-i häkkimine?
PostitusPostitatud: 25 Aug, 2017 19:59 
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Mul on õppustel olnud Garmini käsi GPS ikka kaasas, aga häda on tavaliselt selles, et mitte etendada endast raadiomajakat, ei hoia ma seda üldiselt sees. Kuskil metsavahel aga kulub terve igavik, enne kui see suudab mingit mõtestatud infot anda. On ka seda juhtunud, et sattudes vastase suurema üksuse kolonni otsa, on see krõbedate sõnade saatel lennanud kus kurat. No ei tööta need metsavahel. Tuli võtta vana hea 1:20 000 kaart, koordinaatide määramise joonlaud, koordinaadid läksid eetrisse, kuskil virtuaalses tagalas kärgatas virtuaalsete D-30te kogupauk ja kohtunik oli sunnitud tunnistama - täpne töö. Peale seda olengi selle koju jätnud ja midagi pole sellest tegemata jäänud. Tuleb lihtsalt pidevalt võrrelda kaarti maastiku orientiiridega ning omada ülevaadet kus sa kaardil oled.

Selleaastasel Kevadtormil sai nähtud, kuidas briti tankistid olid jännis keskpolükal õigele ristmikule "pihta saamisega", tiirutasid ikka päris pikalt, enne kui leidsid, võib-olla seesama GPS sõltuvus ja paberkaartide unustamine.

_________________
/Veelgi hullem on see, et koos kohustusliku patriootliku riigioptimismi kehtestamisega nõrgeneks paratamatult ka meie ohutaju, mis on enesealalhoiuks vältimatult vajalik instinkt/ S. Mikser 2014.


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 Teema pealkiri: Re: GPS-i häkkimine?
PostitusPostitatud: 25 Aug, 2017 22:17 
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Kapten Trumm kirjutas:
Mul on õppustel olnud Garmini käsi GPS ikka kaasas, aga häda on tavaliselt selles, et mitte etendada endast raadiomajakat, ei hoia ma seda üldiselt sees.


Ehk valgustad ka teisi, et mis sagedusel ja mis võimsusega GPS eetris kiirgab? Minu teada peaks GPS seade siiski ainult signaali vastu võtma, mitte edastama.


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 Teema pealkiri: Re: GPS-i häkkimine?
PostitusPostitatud: 25 Aug, 2017 22:49 
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See kui kiirelt naviseade esimese lugemi saab ja asukoha tulemi annab (initsialiseerimise aeg) oleneb kõvasti ka seadmest.

viewtopic.php?p=476295#p476295

Tsiteeri:
1. Cold Start Time to First Fix
TTFF (Time To First Fix) is a measure of how quickly a receiver performs the signal search process. The search process, or ‘signal acquisition’, has two dimensions. The C/A code (The GPS SPS Coarse Acquisition ranging code) dimension associated with the replica PRN (Pseudo-Random Number) code, and the Doppler dimension associated with the carrier.

A Cold Start TTFF is defined as the time between application of power to a receiver and it obtaining the first valid navigational data point, when the following criteria are met:
Time unknown
Current almanac and ephemeris unknown
Position unknown

2. Warm Start TTFF
A Warm Start TTFF is defined as the time between application of power to a receiver and it obtaining the first valid navigational data point when the following criteria are met:

Time is known
Almanac is known
No ephemeris (or the data is more than 4 hours old)
Position within 100km of last fix

3. Hot Start TTFF
A Hot Start TTFF is defined as the time between application of power to a receiver and it obtaining the first valid navigational data point when the following criteria are met:

Time is known
Almanac is known
Ephemeris is known
Position within 100km of last fix


AG Leader GPS1000 https://www.google.ee/url?sa=t&source=w ... 0TjcKAJdSw
Cold start time 120 sec

Garmin GLO https://buy.garmin.com/en-GB/GB/p/109827#specs
Hot Start Time: 3–5s
Warm Start Time: 35s
Cold Start Time: 60s

Garmin GPSMAP 545s Marine Navigator https://www.rakuten.com/prod/garmin-gps ... 65027.html
Cold Start Time 45 Second

Garmin Gpsmap 60CX Handheld GPS Receiver https://m.ncix.com/products/specifications/55201
Cold Start Time 38 Second
Warm Start Time 1 Second

Jne.

Nutiplutide (nutitelefon koos GPS või GLONASS jms) Cold start time võib olla 10 või 20 minutit ka (A-GPS võib vähendada seda 2-5 minutile) ja vahel jääbki initsialiseerima.... see on skaala teine äärmus.


Kellele on tähtis kiire asukoha FIX see peaks uurima neid seadme start time'sid.


Ja meri ongi parim koht kus saab niiviisi navigeerijat lollitada.
Maismaal on see kohe näha.

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 Teema pealkiri: Re: GPS-i häkkimine?
PostitusPostitatud: 28 Aug, 2017 16:14 
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Venemaa võimekusest GPS signaali häkkida
http://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/13 ... ittershare

_________________
Ainus, mida me ajaloost õpime, on see, et keegi ei õpi ajaloost midagi.
Live for nothing or die for something.
Kui esimene kuul kõrvust mõõda lendab, võib kogu poliitika(demokraatia ja seadused) ära unustada.


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 Teema pealkiri: Re: GPS-i häkkimine?
PostitusPostitatud: 29 Aug, 2017 22:50 
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Põhjalik postitus mis lahkab viimast kahte USA sõjalaeva kokkupõrget, siin palju tsiteeritud Soome mereväe kogemusega blogijalt:
https://corporalfrisk.com/2017/08/28/collisions-at-sea/

Tsiteeri:
There has been a number of speculations in that there would be foul-play such as GPS-spoofing or hacking of key systems would have caused the accidents. However, as described above the COLREG does not depend on the position of your vessel, nor does it allow the bridge watch to depend upon systems such as AIS for watchkeeping. Regardless of if some of these were out of order, the watch need to observe the position of the other vessels around it and react accordingly (i.e. keep a safe distance and give way to vessels according to relevant rules). Even if something was hacked or the GPS was out of order, and to my understanding there is no indication of this being the case, this should not cause a collision in and by itself.

Ning väljaõppe/lähetuse tsüklist Hispaanias, USAs ning Jaapanis baseeruvatel USA hävitajatel/ristlejatel. Igalpool mujal baseeruvatel laevadel on teatud väljaõppe periood. Jaapani omade tempo on nii karm, et 33% ajast on laevad hoolduses ning ülejäänud 66% ajast merel. - 0 vahepealset tutvumist väljaõpet (samas meeskonnad vahetuvad pidevalt, madrused tihti noored uued):

Pilt

Tsiteeri:
This brings us back to an issue which has been raised, and which I believe might very well explain the issues at play. The US 7th Fleet is severely overworked, with no time being allocated for training in the deployment schedule of the destroyers and cruisers. This in turn means that much of the training is handled while on deployment, with the older crew members likely overseeing younger ones during time they otherwise would be off-duty. In the end, this likely leads to the crew as a whole being less rested. The background to this is obviously the lack of any frigates or corvettes in the US Navy, meaning that the destroyers and cruisers has to do a host of tasks which they are overqualified for, and with tensions with China increasing the need for qualified ships are going up as well. The LCS-project was meant to solve part of this issue, providing a light ship for patrol and flag-waving duties were a destroyer isn’t needed, but as is well-known this has run into problems and delays.


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 Teema pealkiri: Re: GPS-i häkkimine?
PostitusPostitatud: 05 Okt, 2017 21:16 
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Veidi veel GPS-i signaalide muutmisest. Põhja-Norras Venemaa piiri lähedal kaotasid lennukid oma asukoha signaali nädala jooksul. GT tõlge norra keelest.
Tsiteeri:
Noise from Russia discontinued GPS signals for Norwegian aircraft

For a week, the Widerøe and SAS airplanes had to do without GPS signals at the airports in East Finnmark. It happened at the same time that the Russians prepared the greatest military exercise for many years.

In advance it was expected that the Russians would also practice electronic warfare during the Zapad exercise in September.

The defense can not confirm that jamming was the reason that the GPS signal dropped out, but the National Communications Authority has repeatedly made measurements in the Kirkenes area that show that the disturbance came from the east.

Trouble from Kirkenes to Berlevåg


Widerøe told NRK that their aircraft experienced the GPS signal falling out between Kirkenes and Berlevåg from 7 September. According to Avinor, disturbances are reported to West west to Alta.

Widerøe contacted the Norwegian Space Center early, which ruled out that the prolonged disturbances could be caused by solar storms.

"It was stable over time. Avinor suspended the GPS approach during the period, says Communications Director Silje Brandvoll in Widerøe. She does not know that their aircraft have experienced something similar in the past.

Come from Russia

"It's hard to say what the source is, but we measured from a helicopter and found the eastern direction from where we were," says John-Eivind Velure, Director of the National Communications Authority.

East of Kirkenes is known as Russian territory. Velure will not wonder what is the origin of the noise signal, which was confirmed by repeated measurements from helicopter on Friday, September 15th.

"Noise may be generated by accidental radiation due to equipment incorrect, but it may also be a noise signal designed to interfere with what we usually call jamming. We have not answered that, "Velure told NRK.

Electronic war

However, military analysts have determined that electronic warfare would be part of the Zapad exercise, which formally started September 14, but actually took a few days earlier. The exercise stretched across large areas from Belarus to the Kolahalvøya near the border with Norway.

"Russians want to use drones in intelligence and monitoring, in addition to electronic warfare, analyst Samuel Bendett said to RealClarDefence.com website before the exercise.

Bendett works for the think tank CNA, funded by the US defense.

A more advanced GPS manipulation was carried out in June, when 20 ships in the Black Sea received fake signals. Thus, they obtained positions with deviations of up to 47 kilometers. Russian authorities are suspected of being guilty.

Ivar Moen, Lieutenant Colonel and spokesman at the Armed Forces Operational Headquarters, said they followed the Zapad exercise closely. According to Moen, they have no indication that the Russians "jammed against Norway". He does not want to wonder more about what may be behind the noise signals.

Never at risk

Both Widerøe and SAS emphasize to NRK that the noise signal never gave any dangerous situations because they use multiple navigation aids in parallel.

Widerøe writes to the Civil Aviation Authority that the case shows how important it is to take care of conventional navigation systems, so that you always have something to fall back on if your GPS is put out of play.

https://www.nrk.no/finnmark/stoy-fra-ru ... 1.13720305

_________________
Ainus, mida me ajaloost õpime, on see, et keegi ei õpi ajaloost midagi.
Live for nothing or die for something.
Kui esimene kuul kõrvust mõõda lendab, võib kogu poliitika(demokraatia ja seadused) ära unustada.


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 Teema pealkiri: Re: GPS-i häkkimine?
PostitusPostitatud: 06 Okt, 2017 11:57 
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GPS tavainimesel ...
Huvitav on märkida, et viimase paari kuu jooksul on minu spordikella (Polar) GPS-andur hakanud valetama. Graafikust on näha, kuidas kohati kaob signaal ja distants võrreldes eelnevaga (kindlad jooksurajad) on muutunud lühemaks - vahel isegi 1,5 kuni 2 km 10km rajal!
Samas aga mõnikord on täitsa täpne!

OT lõpp!


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 Teema pealkiri: Re: GPS-i häkkimine?
PostitusPostitatud: 06 Okt, 2017 12:13 
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mart2 kirjutas:
GPS tavainimesel ...
Huvitav on märkida, et viimase paari kuu jooksul on minu spordikella (Polar) GPS-andur hakanud valetama. Graafikust on näha, kuidas kohati kaob signaal ja distants võrreldes eelnevaga (kindlad jooksurajad) on muutunud lühemaks - vahel isegi 1,5 kuni 2 km 10km rajal!
Samas aga mõnikord on täitsa täpne!

OT lõpp!


Sellistel juhtudel ma ikka võtan välja oma lepingud GNSS (global navigation satellite system) teenuste pakkujatega ning loen, mis tasemel teenust nad mulle tagama peavad.

Ja siis saan aru et see on as-is tasemel teenus


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 Teema pealkiri: Re: GPS-i häkkimine?
PostitusPostitatud: 06 Okt, 2017 12:25 
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smr kirjutas:
mart2 kirjutas:
GPS tavainimesel ...
OT lõpp!
Sellistel juhtudel ma ikka võtan välja oma lepingud GNSS (global navigation satellite system) teenuste pakkujatega ning loen, mis tasemel teenust nad mulle tagama peavad.
Ja siis saan aru et see on as-is tasemel teenus
Lihtsalt juhtisin "OT" korras tähelepanu, et -
a) see võib puudutada ka tavainimest, ja
b) probleemid algasid samal ajal kui eelpool kirjeldatud sündmused meredel.

Veel kord - oli näitlik konstateering ja ei pea vajalikuks seda pikemalt siin edasi arutada. Tänan!


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 Teema pealkiri: Re: GPS-i häkkimine?
PostitusPostitatud: 06 Okt, 2017 12:54 
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L1 ja L2 (ka L5) kanaleid koos kasutatavate mõõteriistade kasutamisel ei ole ebaloomulikest "ämbritest" meie kandis tänase seisuga kuulnud.
Samuti kohalikke diferentsjaamu paranditeks kasutavate RTK mõõtesedmete puhul, GBAS (LAAS) kasutavate seadmete puhul, ega ka ainult L1 kanalit ja SBAS (WAAS, meil siin siis EGNOS) parandeid kasutavate riistade puhul. :scratch:
Pole märgata ka erinevusi ainult GPS seadmete ja nt. GPS & GLONASS seadmete kasutamisel. Vähemalt ei ole mina sellest midagi kuulnud ega kogenud (aga ilmselt oleks, kui midagi sellist järsku toimuma hakkaks).
http://www.eava.ee/opiobjektid/sidenav/4/materjal.html

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 Teema pealkiri: Re: GPS-i häkkimine?
PostitusPostitatud: 07 Okt, 2017 9:55 
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Norrakad täpsustavad.
Tsiteeri:
Flyers from Widerøe and SAS responded when GPS systems in Finnmark did not work as usual in September. On the ground everything seemed normal, but in 2000-3000 feet, the system was largely unusable for a week.
The noise signals were documented in several measurements from helicopters in the Kirkenes area, carried out by experts in the National Communications Authority.

Practice jamming

However, they could not determine what was the source of the noise, and kept the opportunity open to the fact that it came from defective equipment.

Now, the Armed Forces' Intelligence Service states that there was a conscious attempt at jamming that put the GPS out of play.

"In conjunction with the Zapad 2017 exercise, the Intelligence Service can confirm that we have both registered and notified the Norwegian authorities about electronic jamming from the Russian side," says Kim Gulbrandsen, Communications Director in Intelligence Service, in an email to NRK.

"Among the exercises on the Russian side are the traditional use of electronic jamming against their own strengths. The equipment in use is intended to interfere with communication and navigation systems. The system used is such that it may affect communication and navigation systems, including GPS navigation, in the border areas on the Norwegian side, "Gulbrandsen writes.

According to a report from Avinor, the disturbances were registered westward to Alta.

Norway was not the target

On Thursday, press officer Ivar Moen in the Armed Forces operating headquarters was very reluctant to comment on the noise signals. But he told NRK that there were no indications that the Russians had "jammed against Norway".

It is also the opinion of the Intelligence Service:

"We believe that this was not aimed at Norway, but was a part of the Russian exercise," writes Gulbrandsen.

https://www.nrk.no/finnmark/e-tjenesten ... 1.13721504

Lisaks oli Rootsi ilmateadetes väga imelik radaripilt, mis näitas selgelt Kaliningradist väljuvat EW signaali.
Tsiteeri:
The radar signal is from Gotland, but the disturbance is in the southeast, which radar image shows.

Pilt
https://twitter.com/Ongaunited/status/9 ... 1062988800

_________________
Ainus, mida me ajaloost õpime, on see, et keegi ei õpi ajaloost midagi.
Live for nothing or die for something.
Kui esimene kuul kõrvust mõõda lendab, võib kogu poliitika(demokraatia ja seadused) ära unustada.


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 Teema pealkiri: Re: GPS-i häkkimine?
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Teatan alandlikult, et minu ülalpool toodud probleem GPS-signaalidega Tartu ümbruses on saanud lahenduse.

Kummaline oli see, et signaal kadus korduvalt ja suht samas piirkonnas. Katset kordasin mitu kordust.
Nüüdseks sai POLAR-i pulsikas (eraldi GPS-anduriga) vahetatud Garmini väärt kella vastu (integreeritud GPS+GLONASS) ja ei mingit muret. Kõrvalekaldeid 10+km rajal ei ole üle 15m!

OT lõpp.


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 Teema pealkiri: Re: GPS-i häkkimine?
PostitusPostitatud: 30 Okt, 2017 20:28 
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Tsiteeri:
Mõni kuu tagasi lugesin ameeriklaste artiklit sellest, et nende laevastikus on liiga palju hakatud lootma igasugustele gee-pee-essidele ja traditsioonilsed, st head navigeerimis- ja meresõiduoskused ning tavad on hakanud kaduma


Hämmastav, kui kiiresti maailm muutub.
Umbes aastat 3-4 tagasi käisin merekoolis ära väikelaevajuhi kursusel ja seal olid paberi, rööpjoonlaua ja magnetparandustega tegevus ikka lõviosa kursuse mahust. Kompassikurss, kaardikurss, tegelik kurss. Sain selle siis omast arust täitsa hästi selgeks, ainult täna vist peab juba meenutama, sest paadisõit käib GPS-i järgi ikka.

Eksamil muidugi (mida kontrollis keski kaptenimundris Veeteede ameti tegelane) keegi väga juuksekarva ei peenestanud, kui oskasid seletada, mille poolest erineb kaardikursist tegelik kurss, siis loeti ülesanne sooritatuks ja võis minna käigusilla simulaatorile näitama oma laevajuhi oskusi kesk Tallinna lahte siirdumisel Admiraliteedi basseini (seal oli oluline ühest toodrist, mis on ka päriselus seal, õigelt poolt mööduda ja sadamabasseinis kiirust mitte ületada).

Kui ma aga kuulen, et USA sõjameremehed on GPS-i sõltuvuses, ehk räägibki see meie ja ameeriklaste tasemevahest.

_________________
/Veelgi hullem on see, et koos kohustusliku patriootliku riigioptimismi kehtestamisega nõrgeneks paratamatult ka meie ohutaju, mis on enesealalhoiuks vältimatult vajalik instinkt/ S. Mikser 2014.


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