www.militaar.net

mutionu kirjutas:https://unews.pro/news/108501/.

Blackhawk kirjutas:...aga kui palju oleks aidanud selle umbes 30 aasta jooksul,

nimetu kirjutas:Üks väidetav põhjus miks Armeenia hävitajaid ei kasutanud on see...

Avatar kirjutas:Et noh nii minul on praegu mulje, et suur osa armeenlaste rahvuskodu loomisest ja rahvuslikust taassünnist 19/20 sajand on täiesti läbi põimunud VF ekspansiooniga endistele Pärsia/Türgi aladele ja revolutsioonilise puhastustulega. Ja ma saan aru, et osa neist ilmselt üritab end VF -ist lahti kiskuda, aga see on üsna sama keeruline, kui näiteks meil britte, rootslasi või noh soomlasi (unustame selle hõimukomponendi) pikalt saata. Ilma Vene Impeeriumi huvideta poleks Kaukaasias kunagi tekkinud armeenlaste enamusega suuremaid piirkondi, millistest nüüd on saanud Armeenia.

Former head of the General Staff of the Armed Forces of Armenia and former Minister of Defense of the NKR Movses Hakobyan on a number of purely military reasons for Armenia's defeat in the war.
The video itself with him in Armenian and more than 1.5 hours. Interesting:
1. Pashinyan on the third day of the war stopped mobilization measures, sending unprepared volunteers to Karabakh instead.

2. Mobilization in the territory of Armenia was completed only by 52%, in the territories of Karabakh by 78%. At the same time, these figures were reached only on the 5th day of the war, at a time when, according to the plan, 40 hours were allocated for this. Further, the lag from the schedule increased even more. In fact, the planned mobilization failed. The reason for this was both the objective countermeasures of the enemy (to which the military did not always react flexibly), and the actions of the political leadership, which actually thwarted the mobilization.

3.
There was no centralized distribution of volunteers, they themselves chose where to go. According to the plan, in each direction the troops were replenished by 50% from Artsakh, 50% from Armenia. Problems arose on the right and left flanks, where it was not possible to ensure the replenishment of the first line units. The volume of replenishment of the first line from the NKR made only 32%. Armenia also failed to achieve the planned replenishment targets. The units on the first line stood exactly until they lost their combat effectiveness in the absence of full replacement of losses. The first three days they were quite successful in solving combat missions. Further, the resource ended, and there was no possibility to replenish them or reinforce them with other parts. Both people and units were absent. The reasons for this lie in the peculiarities of pre-war planning and the quality of preparation for war.

4. In accordance with a certain "secret decision", before the war, 5 artillery regiments were reduced, which had a materiel, headquarters, etc., and which were to be deployed after mobilization. As part of the "optimization", it was decided to abandon them. A similar fate befell several companies in Karabakh itself, which were reduced in order to save money. It was these companies that were supposed to hold the second line of defense and, after mobilization, be manned and brought together into battalions sitting in the fortified areas, ensuring greater operational stability of the entire formation of the Armenian troops. In addition, in some companies, for the purpose of "optimization" and "economy", individual platoons were reduced. In a significant part of the squads, the number of fighters was reduced from 11 to 9. That is, the "optimization" of the armed forces was of a complex nature and led to far-reaching consequences.

5. Already at the beginning of the war, more than 1.5 thousand people deserted from the Armenian troops, who fled to the territory of Armenia, because they were initially assigned the wrong tasks. Some were brought back after explanatory work.

6. The purchase of the Su-30SM and the Osa air defense system is a mistake, since they did not fully take part in the Karabakh war. The blame for this incompetent decision lies with Pashinyan and his henchmen in the leadership of the Armenian Armed Forces.

7. During the 44 days of the war, the Armenian authorities deliberately misinformed the Armenian society, which did not fully realize the gravity of the situation at the front, many times exceeding the standard volumes of misinformation in the event of a war.

8. Hakobyan praised himself for the fact that under him they bought from Russia MLRS "Smerch", SAM "Tor", MANPADS "Verba" and "Igla", which showed themselves well in the Karabakh war. The "Needles" and "Torahs" accounted for the bulk of the downed Azerbaijani and Turkish UAVs.
"Torah" was purchased in 2017-2018 under Sargsyan. Until 2022, it was planned to purchase two more "Thor" divisions, 1 "Smerchi" division and a large batch of modern Russian ATGMs and grenade launchers. But due to Pashinyan's coming to power, the plan for the purchase of weapons was revised and instead of the above, they bought from the Russian Federation Su-30SM fighters without missiles (there are serious restrictions on the supply of weapons for them) and outdated Osa air defense systems, spending money on them, which were intended for modern "Torah" and "Tornado". According to Hakobyan, the reason for this change is that the Su-30SM and the Osa air defense missile system can be bought quickly and cheaper, while the Torah is more expensive and the full delivery will take longer. Actually, this is the answer to the question of why the Armenians were so bad with the air defense.

9. Hakobyan confirmed that in the course of the hostilities Armenia used Iskander OTRK, but did not specify the purpose and result of the attack.

10. The preparations for the war were thwarted by the Chief of the General Staff of the Armenian Armed Forces Davtyan, who appeared in this post after Pashinyan came to power. Under him, the number of staff workers increased by 95%, and the number of real fighters decreased. The plans for defense in Karabakh and plans for the purchase of weapons were also changed for the worse. Hakobyan calls the decision on this appointment completely illiterate. Davtyan was replaced by Pashinyan in June 2020.

Jaanus2 kirjutas:Nad võiksid sellest Suur-Armeenia kiiksust üle saada. Kui kreeklastel oleks samasugune kiiks, siis poleks Türgit olemaski, kõik üks Suur-Kreeka.

Kriku kirjutas:Julge väide.

krizz kirjutas:Eks see Armeenia kaotuse peamine põhjus ole ikkagi selles, et loodeti kindlalt Venemaa abile.

Avatar kirjutas:Esiteks Kriku - ma ei hakka sinuga pikka ja andmepõhist vaidlust pidama, kui sa ei suudad hoiduda eetri täis laskmisest enne, kui oponendil on aega omapoolsete vastuargumetidega välja tulla. Ja see on väga otsene viide neoliitikumi kasvuhooneefektile.

Avatar kirjutas:Niisiis - kui keegi mingite Tigranite või Herodeste tõttu väidab, et maa X kuulub neile, siis kas ma saan aru, et monarhia on see, mis õigustab/põlistab mingil ajahetkel mingit kroonikandjat kummardanud inimeste õiguse mingile maale?

Ilma Vene Impeeriumi huvideta poleks Kaukaasias kunagi tekkinud armeenlaste enamusega suuremaid piirkondi, millistest nüüd on saanud Armeenia.

Avatar kirjutas:Et näiteks Juudid olid juudid 2000 aastat tagasi ja tänapäeval on nad ikka täpselt samasugused juudid ja õiglusjärglased, ja seetõttu omavad õigust Israeile ja Jordani kallastele?

Avatar kirjutas:Aga anakronismina - eestlasi ei olnud üldse 1000 aastat tagasi olemas, peamiselt seetõttu, et neil lihtsalt ei olnud kunni, ja seega pole meil üldse midagi kobiseda.

Avatar kirjutas:Armeenlaste osakaalu puudutava väite tõestuseks ma esitan selle lingi:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_Armenia
Until the mid-fourteenth century, Armenians had constituted a majority in Eastern Armenia.[6] At the close of the fourteenth century, after Timur's campaigns, Islam had become the dominant faith, and Armenians became a minority in Eastern Armenia.[6]

Some 80% of the population of Iranian Armenia were Muslims (Persians, Turkics, and Kurds) whereas Christian Armenians constituted a minority of about 20%.[7] As a result of the Treaty of Gulistan (1813) and the Treaty of Turkmenchay (1828), Iran was forced to cede Iranian Armenia (which also constituted the present-day Armenia), to the Russians.[8][9]

After the Russian administration took hold of Iranian Armenia, the ethnic make-up shifted, and thus for the first time in more than four centuries, ethnic Armenians started to form a majority once again in one part of historic Armenia.[10] The new Russian administration encouraged the settling of ethnic Armenians from Iran proper and Ottoman Turkey. As a result, by 1832, the number of ethnic Armenians had matched that of the Muslims.[7] Anyhow, it would be only after the Crimean War and the Russo-Turkish War of 1877-1878, which brought another influx of Turkish Armenians, that ethnic Armenians once again established a solid majority in Eastern Armenia.[11] Nevertheless, the city of Erivan remained having a Muslim majority up to the twentieth century.[11] According to the traveller H. F. B. Lynch, the city was about 50% Armenian and 50% Muslim (Azerbaijanis and Persians) in the early 1890s.[12]