Terrorirünnakud Euroopas

[Kriku]

See on tore, kuidas mõned forumandid on igal alal asjatundjad. Suured sõjandusteoreetikud, religioonipsühholoogid, kriminoloogid, poliitikavaatlejad ja ajaloolased. Ei väsi üllatamast.

Enesetaputerroristide (nn. "inimpommide") tüüpilise profiili kohta on suurel hulgal psühholoogilist uurimistööd. Tavapäraselt ei tule nad varavastaste kuritegudega tegelevate jõukude hulgast.

http://www.haaretz.com/profile-of-a-sui ... 21-1.67906
http://www.terrorismanalysts.com/pt/ind ... rsona/html
https://books.google.ee/books?id=YlhOAg ... rd&f=false

jne jne.

Nagu öeldud, minu ala see ka ei ole, aga ma vähemalt katsun lahmimast hoiduda...

Ksf mäger, usun, parandab mind, kui eksin.

[kert122]

Põgenikevoolu jaoks on meil muidu oma teema: http://www.militaar.net/phpBB2/viewtopi ... 38#p461438

IS peab revolutsioonilist sõda nagu omal ajal Nõukogude Venemaa ja sellises sõjas ongi kõik vaenlased, sest ehitatakse uut paremat ilma vana rusudele. Kuna aga IS tegutseb sellise ettevõtmise jaoks imeväiksel territooriumil, ei saa üle ega ümbert mõttest, et leidub suurriike, kes seda tegelikult toetavad.

Ma loodan väga, et ksf kert122 ei propageeri pantvangikriiside lahendamiseks meetodit, milles ehitis, kus neid hoitakse, maatasa tehakse ja kõik, kes sees, ära tapetakse?

ei, absoluutselt mitte, lihtsalt tõin näite, kuidas terrorile nulltolerantsiga vastati, ja väga karmilt vastati.
Pealegi, kõik see info, mis liikvel on ja mis on tänaseks teada, on tõenäoliselt karmi filtriga, luureametkondadel on ilmselt palju rohkem teada kui meil, ja infomüra on palju.

[Kapten Trumm]

Migratsiooni piiramisega suudame ennetada ehk aastate pärast tekkida võivaid probleeme. Praegu aga maja põleb: terroristid on valdavalt EL kodanikud ja neid ilma tõenditeta pikemaks ajaks trellide taha pista ei ole võimalik. Meie tänase probleemi vastu aitavad ainult:

1) Korralik operatiiv- ja agentuuritöö Euroopas, kasutades selleks riigi kõiki võimalusi, sealhulgas sissetulekuga mõjutamist ja koostööle sundimist. Enamik koputajatest värvatakse ikka intensiivselt mõjutades.
2) Surve suurendamine terroristide mahitajatele ja vaimsetele isadele Islamiriigis. Islamiriik tuleb selle peale likvideerida. Väga vastik töö, aga tuleb teha.

Aga miks mitte korralik ajupesutöö, selgitamaks terrorismi vastuvõetamatust koraani mõistes ja korralikku ISISe propagandat, samuti ISISe plärakanalite kiirelt sulgemist internetis. Täna seda ei tehta ja moslemile on jäetud võimalus tuhnida mööda araabiakeelseid terrori-, ekstremismi jne saite.

[Kotov]

Oleks loogiline, kui mingi pauk käiks varsti ka Saksas. Väga loogiline. Ma julgen Rootsit järgmisena välja pakkuda, kuigi ka Saksa versioonile on väga raske vastu vaielda.

Nõus. Ma pakuks lisaks veel ka Soomet. Üllatusefekt oleks üsna vägev - selline justkui rahulik, turvaline ja unisevõitu põhjamaa ja korraga...

Soome ei ole kuigi loogiline.
Oletaksin et üritatakse lüüa nuga sinna kus sel on kõige suurem mõju ja uudisväärtus hirmu külvamisel, seega euroopa keskmesse ehk pealinnadesse. Pariis oli, Brüssel (de facto EL pealinn) oli, järgmised valikud võiks olla - Berliin või London. Kuna Berliin ikkagi endine ida-saksa, kus pabulaste kontsentratsioon ja tolerantsuskultus vast nii heal järjel veel pole siis jääb järele 1 peamine variant.
London

Jalgpalli EM Prantsusmaal on ju ukse ees, see oleks kohe eriline sweet spot.

[Fucs]

Enesetaputerroristide (nn. "inimpommide") tüüpilise profiili kohta on suurel hulgal psühholoogilist uurimistööd. Tavapäraselt ei tule nad varavastaste kuritegudega tegelevate jõukude hulgast.

http://www.haaretz.com/profile-of-a-sui ... 21-1.67906
http://www.terrorismanalysts.com/pt/ind ... rsona/html
https://books.google.ee/books?id=YlhOAg ... rd&f=false

jne jne.

..ja alustada võiks https://www.raamatukoi.ee/cgi-bin/raamat?12828

****************************************************************************

Nii palju siis EU "põliselanikest"

The Federal Judicial Authorities report that the terrorist suspect that had been known under the false name of Soufiane Kayal has been identified as Najim Laachroui, a 24-year-old man that left for Syria in February 2013.

Najim Laachroui’s DNA was discovered at a safe house used by terrorists in Auvelais, near Namur and in a flat in the Henri Bergéstraat, in the Brussels municipality of Schaarbeek.

Salah Abdeslam’s DNA and traces of explosives were also found at the flat in Schaarbeek. ON 4 December, the Federal Judicial Authorities issued an APB for the capture of Soufiane Kayal land a second man Samir Bouzid.

They were with Salah Adbeslam when in a cart hat was checked by Hungarian police on 9 September. They were both in possession of forged Belgian identity documents.

Under his false name of Soufiane Kayal, Najim Laachroui rented the safe house in Auvelais. Meanwhile, Samir Bouzid’s identity card was used to transfer 750 euro to the account of Hasna Ait Boulahcen, the cousin of Abdelhamid Abaaoud. Mr Abaaoud and Ms Ait Boulahcen died during a police raid on a flat in Saint-Denis, north of Paris, the week after the 13 November terror attacks.

Samir Bouzid was identified last week as Mohamed Belkaïd. The 35 year-old was shot dead during last week’s anti-terrorist operation in the Brussels municipality of Vorst.
http://deredactie.be/cm/vrtnieuws.engli ... /1.2607146

Terrorist Bombings Strike Brussels: What We Know
Updated March 22, 20168:07 PM ET
http://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/ ... ls-airport

[KLE]

Nii see paraku kipub olema. Täiesti nõus ka väitega, millega tuleks tegelikult heita kõrvale senised arusaamad asjaga tegelemiseks - meie õigussüsteem ja moraalsed tõekspidamised lihtsalt "nendele" ei mõju ja selle järgi "nad" ka ei ela.

Ma vabandan, et kordan ennast, aga ärge tehke endale illusioone. Täpselt sama käib tavakuritegevuse kohta juba aastakümneid ja kõik teavad seda. Praegune karistuspoliitika ei kasvata ühtegi varast ümber ega neutraliseeri ka temast lähtuvat ohtu rohkem kui ajaks, mil ta otseselt kinni istub. Ning see lüheneb pidevalt.

Terrorismi puhul tuleb see probleem küll reljeefsemalt esile, sest igakord on laibad taga, aga see pole mitte ühestki otsast terrorismi jaoks spetsiifiline probleem. Meie ilusal ajal rakendataksegi teadlikult karistuspoliitikat, mis töötab halvasti, sest et selline on poliitiline tahe.

Ma arvan, et me räägime tegelikult natuke erinevaist asjust. Ma ei võta sõna karistuspoliitika osas (millises osas sul ju täiesti õigus ja mille suhtes mingeid illusioone ei ole) vaid üldiste arusaamade muutmises. Selle all mõtlen eeskätt tänases õigusruumis täiesti mõeldamatute meetmete tarviduselevõttu (kuni islami defineerimiseni seadusandlikul tasemel ideoloogiana ning seejärel selle keelustamist). Ka selles, et seda (vähemalt niipea) ei juhtu, mul illusioone ei ole. Seega on praegune lahendus üksnes "harjume ära". Kahjuks.

[Kriku]

Niimoodi jõuame NSVL süsteemini, kus "ideoloogiliselt lähedasi" pätte ja §58 kõikvõimalike punktide järgi süüdi mõistetud poliitvange koheldi erinevalt.

NSVL-is oli ka suur hulk kirjandust keelatud, Piiblist alustades (mingi ajani), kuid ometi kõik lugesid.

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"Newseek" veristest nolkidest:

Jihadi Cool: Belgium’s New Extremists are as Shallow as They are Deadly
By Kurt Eichenwald On 3/22/16 at 6:58 PM
03_22_Brussels_Attack_Crowd_01
Police control access to the central train station following the bomb attacks in Brussels on March 22.Reuters

Anyone surprised by the murderous attack in Brussels has not been paying attention. On a per capita basis, Belgium has been Europe’s hotbed of young Muslims who travel to Syria to fight alongside the Islamic State militant group (ISIS) and then return home, often ready to kill. But the world should hesitate before crediting this attack to ISIS, because doing so tends to infuse the group with power that it does not have.

These European attackers are not like the Al-Qaeda members of old—the radicalized adherents to fundamentalist Islam. Many of these new age killers were small children when the World Trade Center fell in 2001 and have spent much of their lives watching major wars in Afghanistan, Iraq and now Syria. Their knowledge of Islam is quite limited; they are more like jihadi hipsters than dedicated Islamists, or what some experts in the intelligence community call “jihadist cool.” They celebrate what the Dutch coordinator for security and counterterrorism called “pop-jihad as a lifestyle.”

These are youths who gather in groups, such as the recently dismantled Sharia4Belgium. They know less about Osama bin Laden than they do about Tupac Shakur; Belgians who travel to Syria to fight often revere the deceased American rapper on social media, identifying themselves with his lyrics about life in the inner cities. But these attackers also have their own rap music, hip clothes popular with young Muslims that are sold by companies like Urban Ummah and slogans akin to what might be found on a bumper sticker (“Work Hard, Pray Hard.”) Their tweets often end with terms like #BeardLife and #HijabLife. While in Syria, they send selfies to their friends showing themselves wearing kohl, a traditional Middle Eastern eye shadow.
Subscribe now - Free phone/tablet charger worth over $60

In other words, these are not intellectual Muslims with long beards and Korans in hand; labeling them jihadis or radical Islamists would be, to them, the highest compliment. In another time or another circumstance, these are young people who would be called losers or narcissistic punks—although they are punks who murder.

It’s easy to confuse Belgium’s new extremists with the ones from the previous decade. The murder of Ahmad Shah Massoud, the leader of the Northern Alliance who was killed just before the 9/11 attacks, was committed by men who plotted their attack in Brussels. A Belgian extremist cell that was part of the Groupe Islamique Marocain Combattant participated in the deadly Madrid train bombings in 2004. The next year, a Belgian named Muriel Degauque blew herself up in an attack in Iraq, making her the first known female suicide bomber from the West. But the old-line extremist networks have no connection to the “jihadist cool” aficionados.

These shallow Islamists have proved to be a challenge for European countries that use a traditional de-radicalization program for Muslims lured into the world of radical fundamentalists: It’s hard to re-educate people about Islam when they knew almost nothing to begin with. In what may be the most representative event depicting the nature of these new Islamist extremists, two British Muslims, both 22, purchased copies of Islam for Dummies and The Koran for Dummies in August 2014 just before they boarded a plane on the first leg of their trip to join ISIS fighters in Syria.

The numbers of young European Muslims who have traveled to Syria to fight alongside ISIS is frightening. Recent intelligence estimates peg the number at more than 5,000, with about 470 coming from Belgium alone. While that is the largest number per capita of any country in the European Union, France is the leader in raw numbers, with 1,700 travelers to Syria.

What lures these youths into the brutal culture of radical Islam? The answer, according to intelligence officials, would be laughable if it was not so deadly: peer pressure and what might be called Rambo-envy.

“For foreign fighters the religious component in recruitment and radicalization is being replaced by more social elements such as peer pressure and role modelling,’’ said a January 18 report by Europol, the European Union’s law enforcement agency, which deals with militant networks. “Additionally the romantic prospect of being part of an important and exciting development, apart from more private considerations, may play a role.”

Here is where things always get politicized. Trying to stop this conversion of young European Muslims into attackers requires understanding what underlies the change. Political blowhards, unable to tell the difference between hard-core Islamic radicals and practitioners of pop-jihad, rage that trying to figure out ways to intercede in that transformation amounts to excusing the attackers, an argument that plays well for the ignorant but that leaves intelligence officials rolling their eyes in frustration. Proclaiming “this was ISIS!”—when it was just punks inspired by the group—grafts the perception of worldwide power onto the organization, making it seem stronger than it actually is, which markets it as even more attractive to young Muslims seeking adventure and attention.

Let the blowhards blow. Here is what needs to be understood about the murderous practitioners of jihadi cool. Based on interviews with European Muslims returning from fighting in Syria, foreign intelligence agencies estimate that about 20 percent of them were diagnosed with mental illnesses before they left for the Middle East. A large percentage of them have prior records for both petty and serious crimes. And the vast majority of them come out of urban neighborhoods torn apart by economic hardship.

Rik Coolsaet, a professor of international relations at Ghent University in Belgium and a senior associate fellow at the Royal Institute of International Relations, recently wrote about the environment that has caused the development of this youth subculture in his country. Young Belgians, faced with a bleak job market, have higher suicide rates and more high school dropouts than most member states of the European Union.

“Youth representatives in Belgium recently warned that many young people are depressed and feel hopeless,” Coolsaet wrote.

The result, intelligence analysts say, is those European Muslims that become fan-boys for ISIS are taking not a rational stand but an emotional one. “Areas where there are close-knit groups of susceptible youth, often lacking a sense of purpose or belonging outside their own circle, have proved to generate a momentum of recruitment that spreads through personal contacts from group to group,” says a December 2015 report by the Soufan Group, a private intelligence analysis and security company.

In other words, attraction to the ISIS philosophy among European Muslins is like a virus, where proximity to the infected is the most common cause. And the locations where the beliefs are spreading can be just as easy to find as the sites where a disease emerges; in November 2015, Belgian Interior Minister Jan Jambon identified Molenbeek, a poor immigrant quarter of Brussels, as a hotbed for young Muslims traveling to Syria and back. So it should come as no surprise that the investigation into the Brussels attack immediately tracked suspects to Molenbeek.

And this is what’s so frustrating about the new hipster pop-jihadism. Intelligence officials know most everything. Belgium publicly identified the location where potential terrorists were most likely to be living. On January 25, Europol announced that the threat of an attack was at its highest level in a decade, warning that both France and Belgium were at the highest risk of an attack by those attacking soft targets in the heart of a large city. That is almost as specific as it gets.

Even with all that knowledge, however, disrupting an attack from this new breed of Islamic fans—rather than religious devotees—is enormously difficult. These are small cells of like-minded young people with operational autonomy, not some organization with top-down leadership like Al-Qaeda. Many of them do travel to Syria to learn tactics from ISIS before heading back home on their own. All it takes is some guns, some homemade bombs and some desire for fame to transform a loser into a hero among his friends and allies. And then the world eagerly attributes the attack to ISIS, which takes a bow for an attack its leaders probably knew nothing about and earns more cred that it uses to attract even more devotees.

So here the answer for solving the problem is quite different from the military strategy that was needed to deal with Al-Qaeda. Europe and America can’t simply attack ISIS and expect the problem to be solved, not unless the Western nations want to stop bombing themselves. This time, it is a law enforcement issue, one requiring sources, informants and sting operations, along with economic plans to create some hope for a future among Europe’s youths.

Or the bombastic politicians and talking heads can continue perpetuating ignorance, banging the once-correct drum about a clash of civilizations; riling up the public about a vast, ISIS-controlled network; and ignoring the less-dramatic solutions that need to be pursued. The West is facing a threat from its own residents who want to be Rambo; it should resist the temptation to do the same.

[Kriku]

Tegelikult on akf-id juba lahenduse osad üles lugenud:
* IS-i ja tulevikus esilekerkivate sarnaste liikumiste likvideerimine nende moodustumise kohas;
* immigratsiooni piiramine;
* agentuuritöö immigrantide hulgas.

Pikk, raske ja tüütu töö nagu kuritegevusega võitlemine ikka. Radikaalseid võluvahendeid ei ole.

Ka selle jaoks on vaja ühiskonna mõtteviisi muutust. Sõdadest Talibani või IS vastu ei pääse, toimugu need siis ükskõik kus maailma otsas nagu ka neile järgnevast ülesehitustööst. Samuti vajavad politsei jm. agentuurid kasvatamist, mitte kahandamist. Seni, kuni elektoraat sellest aru ei saa ning populistlikud poliitikud nende mahategemise pealt punkte koguvad, ei lähegi midagi paremaks.

[kana tagumik]

kui täideviijad on kohapeal sündinud eidea mitmenda põlvkonna (moslemid) ja veel elavad ka piirkondades, kuhu riigivõim ei söanda minna, siis on jälgimine/ennetamine keeruline, midagi hoiab ära, aga mitte kõike. Inspiratsiooni/instruktsioonide/ajupesu saamiseks internet alati käepärast.

Põgenike kriis lihtsalt on sisse imbumisel ja varjumisel soodustav tegur, aga mitte põhjus nagu ekre püüab väita. Multikultismi promo on soodustav tegur, aga mitte põhjus, jne. Radikaalsuse algideed tulevad tuntud teada radikaalsetest riikidest, keda naljalt ei kritiseerita kah.

[aest]

Vahest on aga asjad hoopis sedasi et ehk oleks Euroopal ja USA-l aeg silmad lahti teha ning vastata ka enam vähem ausalt sellele küsimusele et kus on paiknemas tänase islamiterrorismi läte? Kas Iraagis? Kas Afganistanis? Kas Liibüas? Kas Süürias? Või hoopis ses riigis mille naftaluti otsas on istumas nii USA kui ka EL ning mille nimeks on hoopistükkis Saudi Araabia? Aga noh...sel teemal me muidugi ei mägise.

[Kapten Trumm]

No moslemite kogukonnas (koos vastavate arusaamadega), eriti kui nad elavad kuskil pundis koos, on valgel mehel suht probleemne nuhkima minna.

[Kriku]

Agentuur tähendabki seda, et värvatakse kogukonna liikmete hulgast informaatoreid.

Terrorism on veel üks rahvusvahelise organiseeritud kuritegevuse liik, millega tegelejaid tuleb üle maailma taga ajada. Vahe seisneb peamiselt selles, et kui narkokartelli õnnestunud veod jäävad märkamata ning tulemused (st. mõnuaine jõudmine reanarkomaanideni ja sellega kaasnev kahju) jaotuvad pika aja peale, siis terroristliku organisatsiooni õnnestumised on kohe kõigile näha ning kuulda. Narkovedajatel võib lasta aastaid tegutseda lihtsalt selleks, et organisatsioon tippudeni kätte saada, terroristidel mitte.

Võitlusmeetod, st. (sala)politseiline jälitamine, on aga ikka üks.

Kusjuures narkosurmade arv ületab suurelt terroriaktides hukkunute oma. Sealsamas Belgias sureb narkootikumide tõttu aastas suurusjärgus 100 inimest.

[Martin Peeter]

Lisaks Patriot Actile, Afganistani ja Iraagi sõdadele oli 9.11 üheks tulemuseks ka see, et värvati juurde 1,5 miljonit nuhki. Ja keda on kõige kergem nuhiks värvata? Seda, kel on muid probleeme kuritegevuse ja maksudega ning neid migrantide hulgas leidub.

[Kriku]

"Mail Online'i" pikk ja pildirohke lugu politseitööst Brüsseli terroristide jahtimisel.

[Raubritter]

Siin foorumis - mulle vähemalt tundub - on enamus veendunud, et venelastele tuleb panna iga sigaduse puhul igasuguse jututa vastu hambaid (nii ülekantud - kui ka tihti otseses tähenduses). Mida kõvemini, seda parem, esimesena ja viivitamatult. Mis on mõistlik ka minu meelest. Aga venelased on peamiselt piirdunud ähvarduste ja kõikvõimaliku salajase sitakeeramisega, vähemalt meie ja "lääne" osas.

Kitsekarjused aga lammutavad lahti kuullaagreid, segavad semtexiga kokku, lasevad grupikaupa rahulikke kodanikke avalikes kohtades vastu taevast või kui parajat hullu käepärast pole, lõikavad päid otsast.
Ja ometi jutlustavad paljud äkki lääne väärtusest ja õigusühiskonnast.

Ei tahagi sellega midagi ütelda tegelikult, lihtsalt natuke imelik on.